Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

Mythic is looking to bottom-feeding their team:

If you want to be a game artist, you need to have studied art. Ditto programming. But if you want to be a world builder and work your way up to designer, the best way in is to start in customer service and impress everyone with how smart, creative, and hardworking you are. We're about to have another round of promotions from the CS pool, but we can't promote those deserving men and women until their replacements are trained. That replacement could be you... and it could be you moving to building and design in 2007. So apply, already.

So, if you want to be an artist you need to study art, if you want to be a programmer you have to study programming. ...And if you want to be a designer you need to bend over and do customer support for Mythic. Duh?

No, really. I cannot stress enough how this isn't just an awful practice (back to what Anyuzer wrote long ago, I don't believe that QA and CS are good places where to cultivate good game designers) but it's also a very bad example to give.

It isn't written anywhere that if you are good at customer support then you can be a good game designer. Nor that you can be good at customer support if you are good at game design. It goes beyond every logic, in fact. But that's not the worst part. The worst part is that the announce denigrates the important work that people do in customer support and QA. That's not the ghetto of gaming, it shouldn't be publicized as something devalorized that is only done by people without any other talent, rejected from other "prestigious" roles, or exploited while they hold tightly onto the remote hope of climbing the social treadmill.

You are really going to risk to fill CS with wannabe designers who have had very bad luck with other opportunities and are now RABID to trample on each other and take advantage of every possible chance. People that couldn't care less about CS and will NEVER do a good work for that simple reason. The very best feeling that they can get out of that work is just a whole lot of frustration. Because their goals don't coincide with their position. They aren't there to do a good work, but to endure it and hope they can make some friends at the higher levels so that they can be promoted among the envy of the other 99% of co-workers.

This type of competition cannot lead to anything good. It's inacceptable to propose jobs with false, remote promises as if the job was a lottery that rewards only one over hundreds. People are gullible, but taking advantage of that is shameful.

So. Good luck with your new position. I can already see an appeal queue. DAoC players are dying to see how smart, creative, and hardworking you are with your replies.

Jessica Mulligan: It isn’t enough to just get a job in customer service at game company and then work your way up the ladder while experimenting with different types of games. Those days are gone.

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

So where should good game designers come from? What fields?

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

Are you being obtuse on purpose? How about software engineers and software designers?

The days of the idea rat need to end.

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

Seriously - what disciplines should a game designer come from if you don't want support and QA to do it? What skill sets, abilities, educational background should a designer have to design fun games?

Software engineers/designers have numerous classes, books, and other sources that they can formally learn software design and coding from. They aren't taught "how to make a game fun and engaging."

Folks bitch long and hard about poor game designers, but until we pinpoint or at least get a clearer idea of what makes a good game designer, then we'll still end up with QA/Support-based game designers.

So instead of complaining about it - come up with some solutions.

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

I want to give a giant "Hear, Hear" to this article.

To answer your question: it depends on the game. For MMORPGs, I think good storytellers make good game designers.

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

You think they'll hire someone who thinks like this.

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

So if we call Mythic's customer service department in a few weeks we get to hear what Abalieno's voice sounds like!!

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

HA! I'll hardly cross the ocean to do customer support ;p

And not because I despise customer support, but because not being able to speak english good enough, it's definitely not a trype of work I could hope to do well.

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

What the FUCK? Customer Service going into Design? Good GOD. That's like promoting a salesman to engineer.

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

I know of a couple people who have started out in Customer Service and were promoted to design. I believe Jeff Butler of the original Everquest started out as a GM. Anyways I am sure Mythic's advertisement was more of a dangling carrot to recruit CS people rather then any serious statement on game design.

relmstein.blogspot.com

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

I have worked various lower echelons of CS for a couple of mmorpgs ( starting with the good old UO.. god that support system was a mess ) and it always irritated me to see to number of applicants who where doing this -solely- to climb the echelons into design.

That is not to say you cannot find good designers from your CS pool ( if anything, we tended to have an intimate knowledge of what pissed of the player base ), but the folks who did CS with the goal of becoming designers often did a lousy job, instead concentrating more on the politics game.

Mind you, thats a story as old as companies

Re: Now Mythic cannot stop being the source of bad examples

if anything, we tended to have an intimate knowledge of what pissed of the player base

This is something that is usually brought up and that isn't even so true.

It's pretty much the same as when they say that a forum is not representative all players. You don't get feedback about the game in CS, you get rants mostly about choke points, hiccups, bugs, quests that do not make sense. I think it's a kind of feedback really superficial and that doesn't delve on the merit of game design, but just about a more or less good execution.

The great majority of the players, especially in a game that works, don't use CS at all.

It's a very partial point of view.

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