Vanguard day

Woot! Five days without writing. I CAN resist!

Now, in honor of Vanguard's launch, here's my view.

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I expect Vanguard to perform worse then EQ2 in the mid term, not because of game design, but because of execution. Bad production choices, bad focus, bad UI, bad engine, bad art, bad models and animations etc...

Bad pretty much down to the little things. Bad for example in something that shouldn't be all that hard to achieve in a AAA title: fonts.

What saved EQ2 was the obstinacy and dedication of its devs. Despite the horrible premises the game improved considerably. It required time and work. I doubt Sigil will do the same, especially when Brad McQuaid was already talking about their second and third mmorpg when Vanguard wasn't even in beta.

In the case I'm right and the game won't perform well, I blame Brad for bad direction first, not for bad game design. I see the popular "hardcore vs casual" debate as secondary in this case.

The awful premises of EQ2 equal pretty much the bad premises of Vanguard. I don't think Sigil will match the dedication of EQ2's team, so this is why I believe it will perform worse. I had NO faith even in EQ2's team, so this doesn't mean that also the Vanguard guys cannot prove me wrong. We'll see. At the same time I also think the two games will compete against each other and I just don't see enough space for both. Either EQ2 or Vanguard will have to withdraw. It's not a good scenario.

From a more general point of view I don't think that having many MMO titles is going to payback, especially in the longer term. The increasing competition will contract the market and push the most strong titles. I don't see as a very smart plan to disperse your resources too much. I think SOE should instead focus on fewer things and try *harder than ever*. This was already proven true when with EQ2 they decided to make less expansions and make them more polishes and well-rounded.

Scott Hartsman confirmed that the choice had a very positive impact. I believe the same principle is valid for SOE as a whole.

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On the forums I see Darniaq and Geldon defending Vanguard rabidly (and in a few cases not even objectively), I respect and value their ideas, but I have to say they have terrible taste with games ;)

Now a few quotes. Haemish:

I'm pretty sure that no matter how many subscriptions VG gets, we'll never hear a straight, true number of subscribers out of SOE anyway unless that number beats WoW.

Which it won't.

What's relevant is how profitable is VG, and those numbers we'll never get. The rest is dick-waving for press releases, and I'm pretty sure the milimeter beater that will be VG's subscriber numbers won't be the subject of a press release. We might get the "X number of VG boxes sold!" back-patting press release, but that's about it.

And Shild:

That's exactly it. There's nothing left to rant about in any way. If these fuckers don't even want to try to create an engaging experience from the first moment you log in, then fuck'em. These people are never, ever, ever going to learn. And when I say these people, I mean MMOG devs. No one wants to think outside the goddamn box, and the people that do think outside the box almost never create any sort of cohesive experience. I realize f13 started off pretty MMOG-centric, and I realize I used to be a lot more tolerant of MMOGs. But it's just not worth the expulsion of any sort of energy anymore. The most any shitty game is going to get out of me is some obscure joke and a photoshop. I just don't have the sort of time to waste that I used to have on this sort of shit. There's too many good games. When a _good_, from the get-go, MMOG comes out, I'll gladly come back and talk about it ad nauseum. But until then? Meh. Waste of customer's money. Waste of development money. Just a big waste of money. Want something positive? I'm sure there's lots of good people at these companies, and I'm glad they have jobs. The videogame industry is a harsh place and those people are the glue that keeps it together. Too bad QA doesn't get paid enough to have the cajones to call something as they see it. When that happens, we might see some positive change.

Re: Vanguard day

Darniaq is "defending Vanguard rabidly"? And "in a few cases not objectively"?
I am trying to understand if you simply cut me off the picture because I am not famous enough in your fishbowly gaming blogosphere, or because I am italian (and there can be only one!). Not that I wanted any recognition for my not so objective vanboism, but to attach that to Darniaq is pretty funny, or unfair (not that he cares about it, I guess).
So they were right after all, you are a tool :)

Besides that, your writeup is spot on.

Re: Vanguard day

Word...it was a piece of shit through beta, its going to be a piece of shit past release.

Re: Vanguard day

As a UI programmer at SGO, I can address your specific example, the font, so let's talk about that.

When we started working on what we knew would be the 'final' UI back in March '06, we were internally aware of the impending publisher switch. Funds were limited, so we started to work with what we could at the time, Arial. When things settled down, the idea of changing to a better font was impractical. That would take days of polish we didn't have. Our time was better spent making the UI usable for beginners and extending the moddability for power users. Arial was the least of our usability concerns. If things suck, nobody is more aware than us, but they will be fixed in order of priority. We still plan to draw or license a better font in the semi-near future.

Now, I'm a fan of your blog because you cheerlead for more creativity in games, but blanket criticism like this serves no benefit. If you don't personally enjoy the game, I would encourage you to recognize the accomplishments of a programming team a fraction of the size of EQ2's or WoW's, and a design team that has been on crunch since last May.

It's your pie to eat if you want to try and predict our success. But if you're going to pin a reason on a negative guess, I'll accept many things other than "dedication." When you claim that we don't care about improving the game, you're not slamming Brad. You're slamming 100 folks whose primary motivation is to make something fun.

Re: Vanguard day

When we started working on what we knew would be the 'final' UI back in March '06

Yeah, the point here isn't whether what you did was justified or not. The point is the final result. The point is that you were late. I don't doubt that there aren't good reasons, and what I pointed out was the bad management.

Thanks for the explanations anyway.

Now, I'm a fan of your blog because you cheerlead for more creativity in games, but blanket criticism like this serves no benefit. If you don't personally enjoy the game, I would encourage you to recognize the accomplishments of a programming team a fraction of the size of EQ2's or WoW's, and a design team that has been on crunch since last May.

I know it's of no use. This site is closing down, I wasn't giving the game a complete review, not even constructive criticism of any sort. I was just commenting the "context", just pointing out bluntly where I stand in the debate.

About recognizing the accomplishment, that's not a problem. But to the public it doesn't matter if the game was built just by one guy, or in ten years. What matters is the final result. If the game can survive and deserve its space in the market. Vanguard has always been publicized as a big budget AAA project, so I'm not going to be mild with it.

About the "dedication", I'm just commenting a general trend and something likely to happen. The point is: what happens if Vanguard doesn't meet the expectations? I wouldn't be surprised if Sigil gets reabsorbed into SOE in the mid/long term. And it's a possibility that when things don't go well everyone decides to scrap everything and redo from start. It happens even with successful games.

I doubt the choice will be "yours". I would never comment the kind of dedication behind the scenes of a single dev, because I cannot see that and it would be unfair. It's the upper management to make the calls and decide of the future of the game.

Re: Vanguard day

As you say, the results matter. And you're completely right that blame falls on management's shoulders, but I would object to the assertion that there was a failure until the results can be analyzed.

Since you seem to be a pretty firm doomsayer, I hope we can surprise you in the next few months. =)

Regards,
-SH

Re: Vanguard day

And I hope to be wrong once again ;)

Even if I also hope that Vanguard teaches a lesson or two.

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